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New York Times columnist Ezra Klein insists his podcast will not be a “show de resistance” during the incoming Trump administration and challenges liberal orthodoxy by believing that President-elect Donald Trump and his movement are “abnormal”.
In the continuation of the edition “The Ezra Klein Show,” Klein responded to listener questions. One focused on Klein’s past invitation to Trump allies to appear on his show, something the listener found “extremely enlightening” but that he “presents the current political scene as ‘normal’ in a way that it’s not .”
“Normalizing MAGA, Normalizing Trump by putting certain people on the show: Any thoughts on this and that accusation?” Klein’s podcast editor Claire Gordon summed up the issue.
“I don’t know what counts or doesn’t count as normal,” Klein replied. “On the one hand, do I think Donald Trump is a normal or even a very stable genius? I don’t think so. On the other hand, he’s already been elected or nearly elected president three times.”
The New York Time’s Ezra Klein insisted that his podcast will not be a “resistance show” during the second Trump administration. (Lloyd Bishop/NBCU Photo Bank/NBCUniversal via Getty Images)
“So who’s more normal, your bespectacled Brooklyn podcast host you’re listening to right now… or Donald Trump? I think trying to treat him as continuously abnormal is a way of trying not to see other people, including him,” he continued . “That doesn’t mean you don’t oppose the things he does or what his world does… There are lines that are very clear to me. Especially arming the government. And I want to be very careful about that.”
“But I want to be pretty clear: don’t expect this show to be a resistance show. I’m not doing this or giving interviews because I’m open-minded. I’m a reporter. I’m curious. I’m trying to understand things so I can make up my own mind,” he added. .
The Times reporter stressed the importance of trying to “understand” Trump and his administration’s actions even as he vehemently opposes them, striking a “balance” he could see as a challenge over the next four years.
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Klein argued that liberals can “understand” the decisions of President-elect Donald Trump and his administration and still oppose them. (AP/Evan Vucci)
“I think there will be things within the Trump administration that are directly on the authoritarian path. That’s him actually trying to do what is academically called an authoritarian breakthrough. And those will be other things — maybe the Department of Government Efficiency or things that happened at Marco Rubiosecretary of state secretary of state or customs — that’s not the case and it should just be reported as normal policy,” Klein said. “And this is another dimension that I think is an effort to make the normal binary — things are or are not normal — makes it difficult. It’s the administration. He will rule the country for the next four years. And parts of that will be politics and politics only. And its parts can be something completely different. Attempt to change or corrupt the system itself.”
“I’m going to try to take everything on his level and the fact that one thing is happening doesn’t mean you have to cover another thing – either way. I think this is going to be a very difficult balance to strike. I’m less of that in the first Trump administration, to be honest,” he admitted.
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Klein dismissed concerns about the “normalization” of President-elect Donald Trump, suggesting it was “a way of trying to not see other people, including him.” (AP Photo/Rick Scooteri)
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Klein continued by summarizing how liberals treated Trump’s first presidency as “illegitimate” between Trump’s 2016 vote loss. Russian investigation as well as the constant “leak” from his own administration about “what a maniac he was”.
“It was much easier, even for the people who were reporting on it, to treat him as abnormal. Because in some ways his own administration treated him as abnormal. And it seemed possible that this was just a one-time fluke in American politics: a butterfly flapping its wings and we got this, and it wasn’t what it was back then,” Klein said. “And my first job on this show is to be a good reporter. I understand that the show is an act of continuous reporting, and I’m not a good reporter and I’m not doing a good job if I’m not actively reporting on this administration.”
“So we’ll see what shape that takes. A lot of them don’t want to talk to me, but it’s not going to be a closed-door policy because Trump is crossing some line in one area — and then there’s no more talking about tariffs or anything, that’s not the way on which I will do my work,” Klein added.
